Message: Conversation Is…
1 Thessalonians 2:9-13
Last Friday, I had lunch with the United Church ministers who serve the congregations in Kildonan and Transcona. One of the ministers, Carol, asked me, “So, are you having a good transition at Immanuel?” I didn’t even need a second to answer the question. “Yes. I am really having a good transition, because I find that this congregation is unusual. People are very open to having deeper conversations with each other, and eager to find and create meaning and purpose. And we ask questions. I like it. I embrace this transition. It’s good and I needed it.”
As you well know, one of our many strengths at Immanuel is that we engage each other in conversation. The ideal I have for us would be that we hold each other like a conversation. We do it often, but I would like to see us do that all the time! In today’s reading, Paul says “When you received the word of God that you heard from us, you accepted it not as a human word but as what it really is, God’s word.”
Paul’s statement really makes me ponder what makes our conversation loving, holy, worthy, and therefore God’s?
One great example from this past week: I was having my regular check-in with my M & P liaison, and I couldn't believe my ears when she reflected on my message, saying, “Our new governance, especially the Council, does not intend to operate on the business model which is - as you said in your sermon - based on patriarchy and power…” I have experienced this amazement many times here at Immanuel so far, from different people, but every time I hear these words coming from our leaders’ mouths - race, patriarchy, power, white privilege - I am so impressed, empowered; I get goosebumps! I didn’t even hear those words at Winnipeg Presbytery! Second, it really tells me that people here deeply listen to each other, and their new minister! We really hold each other in conversation!
Conversation is the opposite of a monologue - a true heart-to-heart.
Another example: I enjoy meeting with Leslie and Lynne, our creative and thoughtful Worship cluster elders, because every time I meet with them, after each meeting I feel that our whole time was held as one beautiful, blooming conversation, even though I think the last feedback I share with them at the end of each meeting has always been, when they asked how it was, “Oh, I am challenged,” in the most positive way. It is a very refreshing experience, because for a long time before coming to Immanuel, I have been thinking that I am the one who’s challenging others. At Immanuel it is reversed! I am challenged to go deeper, to be truer, and to really engage with the questions that we present to each other, between us, with absolute trust. We value the importance of questions - the key element which transforms conversations into treasures.
At our last meeting, we were talking about communion. I especially appreciated how meaningful communion is for Immanuel: not just as a formal liturgy which completely matches and responds to our expectations, and goes no deeper than that. What our elders taught me was that our passion surpasses this expectation - response cycle. Communion must be a communal, resurrection experience with Jesus, for us through language and hymns which are thoughtfully picked and prayerfully written to give fresh human spirit and invite us into a theological conversation. I loved it. Communion as a theological conversation. Wow! Okay! Then I got to wondering, (silently thinking to myself) ‘What about time? People will not be happy if the service gets longer!’ Then, Lynne looked at me, as if she read my mind, and said, “You can give a very short message. It can be four minutes. And people like it.”
Last week I met with Nancy, my predecessor and friend (more safely, colleague; I once called her my ‘elder’ - and she said, “Oh, I am really not.”) for a conversation about some other questions. I have many questions – but you already know that. One reason for all of my questions is Immanuel’s unusually creative congregation - always evolving. For example, Immanuel’s new governance model, based on eldership and equal sharing of power. Its beauty and depth of Christian feeling impress me deeply – and inspire so many questions! At the end of our conversation, Nancy and I briefly talked about communion. I said, “So you wrote communions!” I loved the moment when Nancy said, in the exact same words as Lynne’s! (which tells me conversation is heart to heart to heart!) “You can give a very short message. It can be just four minutes. And people like it.”
I should admit that it’s a challenge: For people like me, a sermon in 4 minutes is harder than 16 minutes!
One reason why I like to be here with you is always, always there’s one more thing that comes as a question: Interesting, inviting, and enlivening. Because we are passionate, we ask questions. Because we engage one another and each other’s questions in conversation, we get excited. We have this trust built on the life togetherness you have been so faithfully nurturing for each other: in our journey, we will be held, like a treasure, no one being left alone. Paul says, “When you received the word of God that you heard from us, you accepted it not as a human word but as what it really is, God’s word.”
In the most loving, holy, worthy conversation, which is an ideality, and the only true way which will eventually lead us safely into the future, as one, holy, brave community, we will learn how to be completely in the moment of being oneself while at the same time being open to others to teach us. Teaching is a gift. Sometimes, this makes us vulnerable, but it also makes us try what we have not done before, so that we become a little more experimental with one more adventure each time. Immanuel has been, is, and will always be evolving in times of new changes, new transition, new learning, discovering the new questions we have not asked and thought about before. May we embrace new reasons to be Immanuel, in holy, loving and worthy conversations.
Conversation Is… Heart to Heart to Heart!
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